The Wisdom of Dying
Every day I receive a newsletter from ParacleteLetter@yahoogroups.com; on behalf of; Chuck Clark [chuck@stationedhere.com] Many of his letters have good insights and I suggest you think about signing up for it.
Today's letter was especially interesting so I am sending it on to you.
“Cast but a glance at riches, and they are gone, for they will surely sprout wings and fly off to the sky like an eagle.” - Proverbs 23:5
Macarius was born in 300 AD in Upper Egypt. He was a disciple of St. Anthony and founder of a monastic community in the Scetic desert.
The wisdom of Macarius can be seen in his advice to a disciple who once asked him how to begin to live in Christ. Macarius told him to go to the cemetery and first scold all the dead, out loud, and then praise them.
When he returned, Macarius asked what reply the dead had made to the reproof and the praise. “Nothing,” the disciple answered.
Macarius said, “Go then and learn neither to be moved by praise or flattery. If you die to the world and to yourself, you will begin to live in Christ.”
Wednesday, April 27, 2005
Russian Prayer Needs
About twenty years ago I had the great privilege of meeting Bill and Kay Martin. They planned to use their retirement time and funds to minister overseas so they came to one of our Life Seminars at College Hill Presbyterian Church. They loved it and decided to go the full way and become lay Helpers and lay trainers.
Unfortunately, Bill's cancer returned and he passed away before they could do much overseas but Kay did a very courageous thing and spent her time in Ukraine ministering to widows. "Now that I am also a widow I can really understand how best to give them hope in heaven," Kay said.
During the several years Kay ministered in this Ukraine she was able to touch thousands of people in a wide variety of ministries. She did a lot to help addicts and reached out to some of the obscure tribes with the gospel.
One of Kay's main projects was to translate some of our materials into Russian and after that was completed she had the Recovery Bible translated. Here is the rub. We sent her translation to Galina in Moscow but the detailed notes that explain the 12 Steps and ways to break the cycle of addiction cannot be found on the files. To make matters worse the man who translated them in Ukraine has moved and we cannot find him.
Galina has set up dozens of Christian Recovery groups all around Russia and they need this information. We have also established a web site so Russian speaking people all over the world can find help in Christ.
We need your prayers that God will reveal that which is hidden.
Galina needs those notes and so do thousands of addicts in Russia.
About twenty years ago I had the great privilege of meeting Bill and Kay Martin. They planned to use their retirement time and funds to minister overseas so they came to one of our Life Seminars at College Hill Presbyterian Church. They loved it and decided to go the full way and become lay Helpers and lay trainers.
Unfortunately, Bill's cancer returned and he passed away before they could do much overseas but Kay did a very courageous thing and spent her time in Ukraine ministering to widows. "Now that I am also a widow I can really understand how best to give them hope in heaven," Kay said.
During the several years Kay ministered in this Ukraine she was able to touch thousands of people in a wide variety of ministries. She did a lot to help addicts and reached out to some of the obscure tribes with the gospel.
One of Kay's main projects was to translate some of our materials into Russian and after that was completed she had the Recovery Bible translated. Here is the rub. We sent her translation to Galina in Moscow but the detailed notes that explain the 12 Steps and ways to break the cycle of addiction cannot be found on the files. To make matters worse the man who translated them in Ukraine has moved and we cannot find him.
Galina has set up dozens of Christian Recovery groups all around Russia and they need this information. We have also established a web site so Russian speaking people all over the world can find help in Christ.
We need your prayers that God will reveal that which is hidden.
Galina needs those notes and so do thousands of addicts in Russia.
Monday, April 25, 2005
A New Russian Revolution
God's timing is wonderful. "Never early, never late..." as the lyrics by Hillsongs go. Just before the Iron Curtain rang down on Communism and opened the doors to freedom for millions of men and women in slavery, a team of us from the USA were teaching Lifeskills in Scandinavia and heard God speak with dreams and visions. That was the call for us to move our ministry into the USSR but it seemed impossible in 1988. (Then it was Equipping Ministries International.)
I just ended an hour telephone discussion with Galina Chentsova, a Medical Doctor and Psychiatrist who heads Lifeways Russia. Galina is quite anxious and needs our prayers.
1. The political pressure is rising from nationalists who want to hold back progress. (Pray for their protection.)
2. She is planning to travel to the USA in the Fall to raise funds for the money but is scared that our government will not allow her to come lest she stay in this country. (Pray for a visa.)
3. Her sister Irene is ill and needs good medical care. (Pray for her healing.)
4. We are trying to get a Recovery Bible online but running into blocks. (Pray for clear sailing.)
5. There is resistance to our work for we are interdenominational. (Pray for peace among Xns.)
Bless you for praying,
Gary Sweeten
God's timing is wonderful. "Never early, never late..." as the lyrics by Hillsongs go. Just before the Iron Curtain rang down on Communism and opened the doors to freedom for millions of men and women in slavery, a team of us from the USA were teaching Lifeskills in Scandinavia and heard God speak with dreams and visions. That was the call for us to move our ministry into the USSR but it seemed impossible in 1988. (Then it was Equipping Ministries International.)
I just ended an hour telephone discussion with Galina Chentsova, a Medical Doctor and Psychiatrist who heads Lifeways Russia. Galina is quite anxious and needs our prayers.
1. The political pressure is rising from nationalists who want to hold back progress. (Pray for their protection.)
2. She is planning to travel to the USA in the Fall to raise funds for the money but is scared that our government will not allow her to come lest she stay in this country. (Pray for a visa.)
3. Her sister Irene is ill and needs good medical care. (Pray for her healing.)
4. We are trying to get a Recovery Bible online but running into blocks. (Pray for clear sailing.)
5. There is resistance to our work for we are interdenominational. (Pray for peace among Xns.)
Bless you for praying,
Gary Sweeten
Friday, April 22, 2005
This Just In
It Wasn't Already Clear?
"CLARIFICATION: Sinners Unhappy With New Pope"
Headline, Grand Forks (N.D.) Herald, April 22
I am very relieved by this fact.
I am enjoying the reactions of sinners and liberals to the election of Pope Benedict. I am, therefore, willing to offer a prize to the person who sends me the best headline or quote about why they do not like the Pope.
You may enter as often as you wish. Just send your nominations to gsweeten@lifewaycenters.com
It Wasn't Already Clear?
"CLARIFICATION: Sinners Unhappy With New Pope"
Headline, Grand Forks (N.D.) Herald, April 22
I am very relieved by this fact.
I am enjoying the reactions of sinners and liberals to the election of Pope Benedict. I am, therefore, willing to offer a prize to the person who sends me the best headline or quote about why they do not like the Pope.
You may enter as often as you wish. Just send your nominations to gsweeten@lifewaycenters.com
How Can Your Kill Your Church?
I am not a Roman Catholic nor do I agree with the theology of the Roman Church or the new Pope. However, I know what builds congregations and denominations and religious movements, and Pope Benedict has the right stuff. He is firmly convinced that the traditional theology of the Roman Catholic Church is correct and that is what builds adherents. Wishy, washy theology kills churches and the Pope is not wishy washy so the leftists cannot stand it.
The following remarks are taken from Phillip Lawler, the editor of the Catholic World Report and of the Web site Catholic World News (www.cwnews.com).
Is the Pope Catholic?
Yes, of course. And critics are disappointed and annoyed that he is.
BY PHILIP F. LAWLER
Ordinarily that question is a rhetorical device, intended to suggest that someone has said something foolish, ignoring the patently obvious. But as cardinals of the Catholic Church gathered in Rome this week, many commentators seemed to wonder whether the next pope would hold firmly to the age-old doctrines of the Catholic faith: Would the new leader of the world's one billion Roman Catholics be ready to compromise on matters such as abortion, homosexuality and the ordination of women?
The public speculation before the papal election suggested that anything was possible--that the church might strike out in a radically new direction. But the 115 cardinals who entered the conclave thought differently. They elected Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, in a remarkably quick conclave, because he was the obvious choice to inherit the legacy not only of John Paul II but also of 264 other Roman pontiffs in a line stretching back to St. Peter. There would be no break in that continuity, no shifts in fundamental dogma.
Yes, the pope is a Catholic. Yet that unsurprising result has clearly shaken many secular liberals--and more than a few liberal Catholics--who feel that they have been somehow cheated of an opportunity. Their vindictive snarls have been prominently featured in the coverage of the new pope's election. Benedict XVI has been characterized not merely as a "conservative" but as an "ultraconservative." Words such as "rigid" and "stern" are ubiquitous. Profiles of the new pontiff rarely fail to mention that as a teenager he was briefly a member of a Hitler Youth group (in which he was enrolled against his will) and the German army (which he deserted). When a London tabloid identified the new pope in a banner headline as "God's Rottweiler," dozens of more respectable journalists gleefully seized on the nickname.
Pope Benedict will be a convenient target for critics whose hostility is really directed against the Catholic Church and its moral teachings.
If you want to grow in numbers, influence and moral persuasion look and see what the mainline church denominations have done over the past 50 years and do the opposite. They have pandered to almost every vice and moral impurity prmoted by the secularists and leftists and attacked the Bible. They have stopped planting churches, stopped evangelizing, stopped overseas missions and enocuraged free sex.
As a result they are dead or dying with few exceptional congregations where traditional Bible based preaching and teaching has triumphed.
Gary Sweeten
I am not a Roman Catholic nor do I agree with the theology of the Roman Church or the new Pope. However, I know what builds congregations and denominations and religious movements, and Pope Benedict has the right stuff. He is firmly convinced that the traditional theology of the Roman Catholic Church is correct and that is what builds adherents. Wishy, washy theology kills churches and the Pope is not wishy washy so the leftists cannot stand it.
The following remarks are taken from Phillip Lawler, the editor of the Catholic World Report and of the Web site Catholic World News (www.cwnews.com).
Is the Pope Catholic?
Yes, of course. And critics are disappointed and annoyed that he is.
BY PHILIP F. LAWLER
Ordinarily that question is a rhetorical device, intended to suggest that someone has said something foolish, ignoring the patently obvious. But as cardinals of the Catholic Church gathered in Rome this week, many commentators seemed to wonder whether the next pope would hold firmly to the age-old doctrines of the Catholic faith: Would the new leader of the world's one billion Roman Catholics be ready to compromise on matters such as abortion, homosexuality and the ordination of women?
The public speculation before the papal election suggested that anything was possible--that the church might strike out in a radically new direction. But the 115 cardinals who entered the conclave thought differently. They elected Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, in a remarkably quick conclave, because he was the obvious choice to inherit the legacy not only of John Paul II but also of 264 other Roman pontiffs in a line stretching back to St. Peter. There would be no break in that continuity, no shifts in fundamental dogma.
Yes, the pope is a Catholic. Yet that unsurprising result has clearly shaken many secular liberals--and more than a few liberal Catholics--who feel that they have been somehow cheated of an opportunity. Their vindictive snarls have been prominently featured in the coverage of the new pope's election. Benedict XVI has been characterized not merely as a "conservative" but as an "ultraconservative." Words such as "rigid" and "stern" are ubiquitous. Profiles of the new pontiff rarely fail to mention that as a teenager he was briefly a member of a Hitler Youth group (in which he was enrolled against his will) and the German army (which he deserted). When a London tabloid identified the new pope in a banner headline as "God's Rottweiler," dozens of more respectable journalists gleefully seized on the nickname.
Pope Benedict will be a convenient target for critics whose hostility is really directed against the Catholic Church and its moral teachings.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
If I were a loyal Roman Catholic I would be very happy that the secularists and media mavens do not like Pope Benedict. Nothing causes a church to grow like being hated by people who despise Christians.
If you want to grow in numbers, influence and moral persuasion look and see what the mainline church denominations have done over the past 50 years and do the opposite. They have pandered to almost every vice and moral impurity prmoted by the secularists and leftists and attacked the Bible. They have stopped planting churches, stopped evangelizing, stopped overseas missions and enocuraged free sex.
As a result they are dead or dying with few exceptional congregations where traditional Bible based preaching and teaching has triumphed.
Gary Sweeten
Thursday, April 21, 2005
How to Kill Your Church
Many of the current denominations we call, "Mainline" began as strong, vibrant centers of faith and spiritual outreach. In the history of this nation we have seen only two instances of tax supported, state churches. In Colonial times both the Episcopal and Congregational denominations were blessed by the government and supported by taxes. They were the largest and most influential groups in America at that time. Now, however, neither is strong or growing. Why?
Perhaps this news story from Truro Episcopal Church in Virginia will help explain how to kill your church and/or denomination.
Latest News
The Connecticut 6
St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Darien, Connecticut is the church where Angela and I found a spiritual home when we moved from England almost 38 years ago. It was a loving community where Jesus Christ was honored. It also was one of the early pioneers in the Charismatic movement and in many ways was a sister church to Truro in the early days of the Renewal movement. It is no exaggeration to say that it changed our lives and was the community that helped us discern our call to ordained ministry.
Today, St. Paul's, together with five other Episcopal Churches of the Diocese of Connecticut, is in the middle of a crisis. Their bishop, Andrew Smith, has declared that their clergy will be inhibited and deposed because they have .abandoned the Communion?in other words, forced out. He has threatened to make this action final on April 15!
This decision was taken during a closed meeting of the Diocesan Standing Committee at which the only presentation came from the bishop. In other words, they were tried, convicted, and sentenced with no opportunity to speak for themselves. They have not even been notified as to the specific actions that have triggered this punitive response. What is even more astonishing is that the charge of abandonment of communion is intended to be disciplinary action for clergy who have made an open renunciation of the Doctrine, Discipline, or Worship of this Church; when in truth, all six churches are conservative parishes who have stood for the faith in an increasingly revisionist diocese.
For more on the story go to:
http://www.trurochurch.org/content.asp?contentid=577
Many of the current denominations we call, "Mainline" began as strong, vibrant centers of faith and spiritual outreach. In the history of this nation we have seen only two instances of tax supported, state churches. In Colonial times both the Episcopal and Congregational denominations were blessed by the government and supported by taxes. They were the largest and most influential groups in America at that time. Now, however, neither is strong or growing. Why?
Perhaps this news story from Truro Episcopal Church in Virginia will help explain how to kill your church and/or denomination.
Latest News
The Connecticut 6
St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Darien, Connecticut is the church where Angela and I found a spiritual home when we moved from England almost 38 years ago. It was a loving community where Jesus Christ was honored. It also was one of the early pioneers in the Charismatic movement and in many ways was a sister church to Truro in the early days of the Renewal movement. It is no exaggeration to say that it changed our lives and was the community that helped us discern our call to ordained ministry.
Today, St. Paul's, together with five other Episcopal Churches of the Diocese of Connecticut, is in the middle of a crisis. Their bishop, Andrew Smith, has declared that their clergy will be inhibited and deposed because they have .abandoned the Communion?in other words, forced out. He has threatened to make this action final on April 15!
This decision was taken during a closed meeting of the Diocesan Standing Committee at which the only presentation came from the bishop. In other words, they were tried, convicted, and sentenced with no opportunity to speak for themselves. They have not even been notified as to the specific actions that have triggered this punitive response. What is even more astonishing is that the charge of abandonment of communion is intended to be disciplinary action for clergy who have made an open renunciation of the Doctrine, Discipline, or Worship of this Church; when in truth, all six churches are conservative parishes who have stood for the faith in an increasingly revisionist diocese.
For more on the story go to:
http://www.trurochurch.org/content.asp?contentid=577
The New Pope
The following article is posted from Peter Jones' newsletter. His
ministry is "Christian Witness to a Pagan Planet." I thought some of
you would find this interesting as the world digests the
implications of the new Pope.
Somewhere in the personal library of the new Pope, Benedict XVI, is
a leather-bound copy of Calvin's Institutes, and (surprisingly) a
copy of my article, "1 Corinthians 15:8: Paul, the Last Apostle." In
the hundreds of stories that will appear about the new pope, this
trivial fact will not appear!
In 1988, representatives from the French Reformed Seminary of Aix-en-
Provence in southern France where I taught for 18 years were guests
at the Vatican through the auspices of some very orthodox French
priests who loved Christ and the Scriptures and who wanted us to
visit Rome. We were shown the more protected tourist sites, such as
Peter's tomb and the pagan necropolis under St. Peter's
Cathedral.
We were also received in the private quarters of Cardinal Joseph
Ratzinger, who at the time was serving his seventh year as Prefect
of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. This same
Ratzinger is now Benedict XVI.
Who is Ratzinger? For liberal observers, he is Papa Ratzi, the
polarizing, ruthless enforcer, the "papal rottweiler," disciplining
Latin American "liberation" theologians, denouncing homosexuality
and gay marriage, and reining in Asian priests who see non-Christian
religions as part of God's plan for humanity.
For Bible believers, his courageous positions, made in the light of a
deep and informed commitment to biblical theism, have created a
bulwark against rising world paganism.
Who is Ratzinger? Here is my personal testimony, for what it is
worth. This very powerful ecclesiastical figure, even then the No. 2
in the Vatican hierarchy, warmly received us, an unimpressive group
of French orthodox Protestant/Reformed theologians, for two hours.
In the first hour, in fluent French, he gave a magnificent overview
of the state of theology and of the dangers of German liberal
theology in particular. His critique of Bultmann was superb.
We Protestants then took an hour to present the case for orthodox
Protestant theology. Cardinal Ratzinger listened with rapt
attention. Our time together was not a casual, nor perfunctory
"audience," but a genuine theological exchange. I was impressed
by his intellect, by his linguistic ability (fluency in at least five languages)
by his theological wisdom and by his openness to biblical theology.
As we left, we gave him a bound copy of Calvin's Institutes, and he
graciously accepted my article on the apostle Paul as the last
apostle. Clearly my article did not change his mind about the papacy
but I have it on good authority that he has been reading the copy of
Calvin's Institutes.
The next day while sight-seeing in Rome I happened to
meet his secretary, a French priest. "How did the Cardinal
enjoy our visit?" I asked.
Without hesitation he replied: "The Cardinal said he wished there was a
seminary like that in the Catholic Church."
I have rarely thought about that moment, until today. As the
presiding Cardinal announced in Latin: "Habemus papam…Josephus…"
I knew it was Ratzinger and I stared at the photo I have had on my
study wall for many years, drawn strangely in to an event of global
proportions.
I began to put things together.When Ratzinger said in his homily
at a pre-conclave Mass in St. Peter's, denouncing the essence of
paganism: "We are moving toward a dictatorship of relativism
which does not recognize anything as definitive and has as its
highest value one's own ego and one's own desires";
When, in his first address from the Vatican balcony he spoke of
the "joy in the risen Lord, trusting in his permanent help";
When, in his first papal homily in the Sistine Chapel, addressing
all Christian churches, he said: I take this opportunity to send all
of them my most cordial greetings in Christ, the only Lord of all";
I did think: "That's the same Ratzinger I met for those two hours
seventeen years ago."
How do Protestants respond, seeing that Rome often masks the pure
Gospel of grace and sometimes places Christ behind Mary and even the
Pope? The massive glistening white marble statue of Mary on a hill
dominates the city of Santiago, Chile, with the head of the Serpent
under her feet, while a small figure of Christ on a little cross
below, to the left, is hardly visible.
How do we respond? This morning, Robert Godfrey, historian and
President of Westminster Seminary in California (where I am adjunct
professor and scholar in residence), ended our daily chapel by
announcing the name of the new pope. He then did something few
Protestants do. He prayed that the Spirit might lead Benedict XVI
into a deeper and fuller understanding of Scripture and the Gospel.
Knowing what I learned about this man in that short but meaningful
encounter, surely this prayer is not in vain.
Peter Jones
Christian Witness to a Pagan Planet
http://www.rbvincent.com/reformedcharismatic.htm
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Reformed-Charismatic/
The following article is posted from Peter Jones' newsletter. His
ministry is "Christian Witness to a Pagan Planet." I thought some of
you would find this interesting as the world digests the
implications of the new Pope.
Somewhere in the personal library of the new Pope, Benedict XVI, is
a leather-bound copy of Calvin's Institutes, and (surprisingly) a
copy of my article, "1 Corinthians 15:8: Paul, the Last Apostle." In
the hundreds of stories that will appear about the new pope, this
trivial fact will not appear!
In 1988, representatives from the French Reformed Seminary of Aix-en-
Provence in southern France where I taught for 18 years were guests
at the Vatican through the auspices of some very orthodox French
priests who loved Christ and the Scriptures and who wanted us to
visit Rome. We were shown the more protected tourist sites, such as
Peter's tomb and the pagan necropolis under St. Peter's
Cathedral.
We were also received in the private quarters of Cardinal Joseph
Ratzinger, who at the time was serving his seventh year as Prefect
of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. This same
Ratzinger is now Benedict XVI.
Who is Ratzinger? For liberal observers, he is Papa Ratzi, the
polarizing, ruthless enforcer, the "papal rottweiler," disciplining
Latin American "liberation" theologians, denouncing homosexuality
and gay marriage, and reining in Asian priests who see non-Christian
religions as part of God's plan for humanity.
For Bible believers, his courageous positions, made in the light of a
deep and informed commitment to biblical theism, have created a
bulwark against rising world paganism.
Who is Ratzinger? Here is my personal testimony, for what it is
worth. This very powerful ecclesiastical figure, even then the No. 2
in the Vatican hierarchy, warmly received us, an unimpressive group
of French orthodox Protestant/Reformed theologians, for two hours.
In the first hour, in fluent French, he gave a magnificent overview
of the state of theology and of the dangers of German liberal
theology in particular. His critique of Bultmann was superb.
We Protestants then took an hour to present the case for orthodox
Protestant theology. Cardinal Ratzinger listened with rapt
attention. Our time together was not a casual, nor perfunctory
"audience," but a genuine theological exchange. I was impressed
by his intellect, by his linguistic ability (fluency in at least five languages)
by his theological wisdom and by his openness to biblical theology.
As we left, we gave him a bound copy of Calvin's Institutes, and he
graciously accepted my article on the apostle Paul as the last
apostle. Clearly my article did not change his mind about the papacy
but I have it on good authority that he has been reading the copy of
Calvin's Institutes.
The next day while sight-seeing in Rome I happened to
meet his secretary, a French priest. "How did the Cardinal
enjoy our visit?" I asked.
Without hesitation he replied: "The Cardinal said he wished there was a
seminary like that in the Catholic Church."
I have rarely thought about that moment, until today. As the
presiding Cardinal announced in Latin: "Habemus papam…Josephus…"
I knew it was Ratzinger and I stared at the photo I have had on my
study wall for many years, drawn strangely in to an event of global
proportions.
I began to put things together.When Ratzinger said in his homily
at a pre-conclave Mass in St. Peter's, denouncing the essence of
paganism: "We are moving toward a dictatorship of relativism
which does not recognize anything as definitive and has as its
highest value one's own ego and one's own desires";
When, in his first address from the Vatican balcony he spoke of
the "joy in the risen Lord, trusting in his permanent help";
When, in his first papal homily in the Sistine Chapel, addressing
all Christian churches, he said: I take this opportunity to send all
of them my most cordial greetings in Christ, the only Lord of all";
I did think: "That's the same Ratzinger I met for those two hours
seventeen years ago."
How do Protestants respond, seeing that Rome often masks the pure
Gospel of grace and sometimes places Christ behind Mary and even the
Pope? The massive glistening white marble statue of Mary on a hill
dominates the city of Santiago, Chile, with the head of the Serpent
under her feet, while a small figure of Christ on a little cross
below, to the left, is hardly visible.
How do we respond? This morning, Robert Godfrey, historian and
President of Westminster Seminary in California (where I am adjunct
professor and scholar in residence), ended our daily chapel by
announcing the name of the new pope. He then did something few
Protestants do. He prayed that the Spirit might lead Benedict XVI
into a deeper and fuller understanding of Scripture and the Gospel.
Knowing what I learned about this man in that short but meaningful
encounter, surely this prayer is not in vain.
Peter Jones
Christian Witness to a Pagan Planet
http://www.rbvincent.com/reformedcharismatic.htm
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Reformed-Charismatic/
Why Churches Shrink
Liberal mainline churches have lost conservative members because they have abandoned that traditional membership niche that they once served, according to sociologists.
"Our studies indicate six basic ideological niches into which churches fall, ranging from ultraliberal to ultraconservative. Most church attendees, regardless of social class, are moderates and conservatives who form the great middle of the membership bell curve," says Dr. Roger Finke, professor of sociology in Penn State’s College of the Liberal Arts.
"Because their demand for different forms of religion is remarkably stable, Americans tend to either remain in or seek out churches that suit their niche," he notes. "Of course, this demand curve represents only those that are seeking a religion. There will always be some that don't seek out religious answers or solutions."
While church swapping occurs frequently in this country, people rarely swap niches. Instead, it is the churches themselves that shift from niche to niche, usually from conservative to liberal, the sociologist adds.
Liberal mainline churches have lost conservative members because they have abandoned that traditional membership niche that they once served, according to sociologists.
"Our studies indicate six basic ideological niches into which churches fall, ranging from ultraliberal to ultraconservative. Most church attendees, regardless of social class, are moderates and conservatives who form the great middle of the membership bell curve," says Dr. Roger Finke, professor of sociology in Penn State’s College of the Liberal Arts.
"Because their demand for different forms of religion is remarkably stable, Americans tend to either remain in or seek out churches that suit their niche," he notes. "Of course, this demand curve represents only those that are seeking a religion. There will always be some that don't seek out religious answers or solutions."
While church swapping occurs frequently in this country, people rarely swap niches. Instead, it is the churches themselves that shift from niche to niche, usually from conservative to liberal, the sociologist adds.
Growing Churches
Acts of Faith: Explaining the Human Side of Religion, by the University of California Press. Finke is co-author with Dr. Rodney Stark, professor of sociology and comparative religion at the University of Washington.
Finke notes that the mainline Protestant churches, at the time of their founding, served a conservative and sometimes even an ultra strict constituency. A classic example would be the Methodist Church, which began as a sect during the 18th century "Great Awakening" in England and was imported by the Wesleys to the American colonies. Famed for its camp meetings, American Methodism flourished in the 19th century, founded dozens of colleges and universities and in 1850 made up one-third of all churchgoers in the United States -- in that year, it had 117 members out of every 1,000 Americans.
"Throughout most of the 20th century, the Methodist clergy have pressed for increased `relevance' and liberalism while downplaying the core Christian doctrines of sin and salvation,’ says Finke. "Their success in doing so has been mirrored by a corresponding decline in membership, with the result that by 1990 only 36 out of 1,000 Americans were Methodists."
In 140 years Methodists went from 117 members per thousand-mpt-to 36 mpt or a loss of 87 mpt.
Acts of Faith: Explaining the Human Side of Religion, by the University of California Press. Finke is co-author with Dr. Rodney Stark, professor of sociology and comparative religion at the University of Washington.
Finke notes that the mainline Protestant churches, at the time of their founding, served a conservative and sometimes even an ultra strict constituency. A classic example would be the Methodist Church, which began as a sect during the 18th century "Great Awakening" in England and was imported by the Wesleys to the American colonies. Famed for its camp meetings, American Methodism flourished in the 19th century, founded dozens of colleges and universities and in 1850 made up one-third of all churchgoers in the United States -- in that year, it had 117 members out of every 1,000 Americans.
"Throughout most of the 20th century, the Methodist clergy have pressed for increased `relevance' and liberalism while downplaying the core Christian doctrines of sin and salvation,’ says Finke. "Their success in doing so has been mirrored by a corresponding decline in membership, with the result that by 1990 only 36 out of 1,000 Americans were Methodists."
In 140 years Methodists went from 117 members per thousand-mpt-to 36 mpt or a loss of 87 mpt.
Popes and Progress
Will the reign of the new Pope Benedict be good or bad? I am convinced it will be good for the Roman Church for he is a man who prmomotes traditional theology and practices including morals and ethics. Many thousands of Roman Catholics are leaving their church to join Evangelical, Charismatic and Pentecostal churches. Pope Benedict's reign may not be good for them is he also promotes a lively faith experience.
Listen to the insights from Starke and Fink in their new book:
A measure of the malaise affecting the "lower-tension" or more liberal denominations is their sluggishness in creating new congregations and thus retaining their market share of believers. "The tiny Vineyard Christian Fellowship, with only 305 existing congregations in 1994, managed to plant as many new churches as did the huge United Methodist Church, which had more than 36,000 congregations," says the Penn State sociologist.
"Our data strongly suggest that niche preferences, more so than many churches, are quite stable, in that most people are in a denomination ideologically similar to the one to which they belonged at age 16," Finke adds.
EDITOR: Dr. Finke is at (814) 865-6257 or at rfinke@psu.edu by email
Will the reign of the new Pope Benedict be good or bad? I am convinced it will be good for the Roman Church for he is a man who prmomotes traditional theology and practices including morals and ethics. Many thousands of Roman Catholics are leaving their church to join Evangelical, Charismatic and Pentecostal churches. Pope Benedict's reign may not be good for them is he also promotes a lively faith experience.
Listen to the insights from Starke and Fink in their new book:
A measure of the malaise affecting the "lower-tension" or more liberal denominations is their sluggishness in creating new congregations and thus retaining their market share of believers. "The tiny Vineyard Christian Fellowship, with only 305 existing congregations in 1994, managed to plant as many new churches as did the huge United Methodist Church, which had more than 36,000 congregations," says the Penn State sociologist.
"Our data strongly suggest that niche preferences, more so than many churches, are quite stable, in that most people are in a denomination ideologically similar to the one to which they belonged at age 16," Finke adds.
EDITOR: Dr. Finke is at (814) 865-6257 or at rfinke@psu.edu by email
Tuesday, April 19, 2005
Depression and Socialism
"Record numbers of Germans are suffering from depression and other
mental illnesses," the BBC reports: According to the research, by a
German health insurance firm, cases of depression among
Berliners have risen by 70% since 1997.
Up to 70% of Germans also say they are prepared to seek
professional help for psychological problems.
Several years ago Dr. Martin Seligman did research comparing West and East Germans on pessimism and depression. The East Side outdid the West Siders by large percentages. Now, just a few years after the Wall came down, the West has caught the virus of pessimism from the Socialists and they are just as depressed as the East Germans.
Seligman and his team read newspaper reports about the Olympic Games and how their East and West German media framed their respective efforts. First, the East Germans outperformed the West Germans in most sports. They won more medals, higher medals and were more successful in almost every way.
However, news reports about the two sides were the opposite. The East German media made their athletes seem to be failures while the West German media celebrated their athletes' successes. The West German population was, for the most part, happy and excited about their teams but the Communists were severely disappointed. There was a world of difference between the two groups despite the fact that they are racially the same.
Thankfully, there is now harmony between the two. Both are depressed, pessimistic and gloomy. The Socialist have finally won the battle. They should have quit fighting long ago and simply taken their gloom and doom to the West and infiltrated the schools, media and political class with liberal nonsense.
Politically Correct Speech and Conduct are viruses to good self esteem, healthy relationships and a healthy debate. To imply that anger, yelling or nasty words will PERMANENTLY wound people is nonsense and will lead to making people weak.
We must instead teach resilience for people can learn how to bounce back from anger, abuse and attacks.
Sticks and stone may break my bones but words will never hurt me.
"Record numbers of Germans are suffering from depression and other
mental illnesses," the BBC reports: According to the research, by a
German health insurance firm, cases of depression among
Berliners have risen by 70% since 1997.
Up to 70% of Germans also say they are prepared to seek
professional help for psychological problems.
Several years ago Dr. Martin Seligman did research comparing West and East Germans on pessimism and depression. The East Side outdid the West Siders by large percentages. Now, just a few years after the Wall came down, the West has caught the virus of pessimism from the Socialists and they are just as depressed as the East Germans.
Seligman and his team read newspaper reports about the Olympic Games and how their East and West German media framed their respective efforts. First, the East Germans outperformed the West Germans in most sports. They won more medals, higher medals and were more successful in almost every way.
However, news reports about the two sides were the opposite. The East German media made their athletes seem to be failures while the West German media celebrated their athletes' successes. The West German population was, for the most part, happy and excited about their teams but the Communists were severely disappointed. There was a world of difference between the two groups despite the fact that they are racially the same.
Thankfully, there is now harmony between the two. Both are depressed, pessimistic and gloomy. The Socialist have finally won the battle. They should have quit fighting long ago and simply taken their gloom and doom to the West and infiltrated the schools, media and political class with liberal nonsense.
Politically Correct Speech and Conduct are viruses to good self esteem, healthy relationships and a healthy debate. To imply that anger, yelling or nasty words will PERMANENTLY wound people is nonsense and will lead to making people weak.
We must instead teach resilience for people can learn how to bounce back from anger, abuse and attacks.
Sticks and stone may break my bones but words will never hurt me.
Commit and Grow
Large churches that stay vital and growing have several things in common. First, they ask a lot from their people.
First, a certainty about theology and scripture. Wishy washy approaches to the gospel and the Bible produce churches and members who are wishy washy about attendance, giving and loyally carrying out their assignments.
Second, they ask for a high commitment to the Lord and to the church. Low commitment churches and parachurch groups get exactly that along with a high percentage of "Free Riders" who get all the benefits with no cost to them. This produces a welfare mentality among the people in the pew. Healthy churches expect people to tithe, volunteer, support missions and outreach.
Third, they maintain a strong emphasis on evangelism and outreach. Many churches forget to evangelize or choose to stop evangelism after they get big. The give in to pressure from certain members who want all the resources given to make the current members more comfortable.
Fourth, they tell the new people and the veteran members about the core values and always attempt to make decisions with these values in mind.
Fifth, they equip their members to do the work of the ministry. This means that the people allowed to lead in Sunday services, teaching, eldership, etc are expected to know scripture and have high ministry skills. The distinction between laity and clergy is insignificant. This is why Wesley was so successful. He had high standards for leaders but an open door for sinners.
Sixth, they are not afraid to challenge people to commit or leave. Weak churches fear losing members. Strong leaders are unconcerned about losing people who do not support the values and vision.
Seventh, they have a strong desire to grow. Weak churches want to stay small and manageable.
The Very Large Church by Lyle Schaller
Also read the Christianity Today article at
Leadership Weekly leadership-html@lists.christianitytoday.com
Large churches that stay vital and growing have several things in common. First, they ask a lot from their people.
First, a certainty about theology and scripture. Wishy washy approaches to the gospel and the Bible produce churches and members who are wishy washy about attendance, giving and loyally carrying out their assignments.
Second, they ask for a high commitment to the Lord and to the church. Low commitment churches and parachurch groups get exactly that along with a high percentage of "Free Riders" who get all the benefits with no cost to them. This produces a welfare mentality among the people in the pew. Healthy churches expect people to tithe, volunteer, support missions and outreach.
Third, they maintain a strong emphasis on evangelism and outreach. Many churches forget to evangelize or choose to stop evangelism after they get big. The give in to pressure from certain members who want all the resources given to make the current members more comfortable.
Fourth, they tell the new people and the veteran members about the core values and always attempt to make decisions with these values in mind.
Fifth, they equip their members to do the work of the ministry. This means that the people allowed to lead in Sunday services, teaching, eldership, etc are expected to know scripture and have high ministry skills. The distinction between laity and clergy is insignificant. This is why Wesley was so successful. He had high standards for leaders but an open door for sinners.
Sixth, they are not afraid to challenge people to commit or leave. Weak churches fear losing members. Strong leaders are unconcerned about losing people who do not support the values and vision.
Seventh, they have a strong desire to grow. Weak churches want to stay small and manageable.
The Very Large Church by Lyle Schaller
Also read the Christianity Today article at
Leadership Weekly leadership-html@lists.christianitytoday.com
Membership and Commitment
Over the past few years many leaders of new congregations have eliminated the idea of "Membership". I have heard several reasons.
1. This is a new era and we will not do anything like our parents or churches of the past. We need new wineskins.
2. We do not want to place any barriers to the front door because modern people are very suspicious of churchy things and may not attend if we do not make it easy to be with us.
3. We do not want to do anything that is not genuine and membership is only a ritual.
4. In my home church many people were members who were not even true believers.
5. Modern people cannot stand anything that smells like commitment.
6. Add your own ideas.
Next time-why we need a commitment to membership.
Over the past few years many leaders of new congregations have eliminated the idea of "Membership". I have heard several reasons.
1. This is a new era and we will not do anything like our parents or churches of the past. We need new wineskins.
2. We do not want to place any barriers to the front door because modern people are very suspicious of churchy things and may not attend if we do not make it easy to be with us.
3. We do not want to do anything that is not genuine and membership is only a ritual.
4. In my home church many people were members who were not even true believers.
5. Modern people cannot stand anything that smells like commitment.
6. Add your own ideas.
Next time-why we need a commitment to membership.
Saturday, April 16, 2005
Expanding Church and Family Leaders
Karen and I do love our grandchildren but we do not want to rear them. The photo below shows our son Timothy and his wife Shelley giving their two month old son, Jack, medicine. It is wonderful to have grown kids who love, nurture, discipline and care for their own children.
The church is a family of families but far too often the pastor is seen as the one person who is to not only do all the reproducing but then fed, nurture, love, heal and educate all the new babies. Remember: Shepherds do not have sheep; sheep have sheep!
Grandparents do not have grandchildren, our children do.
If you are a pastor or evangelist that thinks you must win, build, nurture, heal, visit and preach, you are confused. You are not God nor are you the parent. We love our grandkids and try to be with them often. However, we are NOT their parents. We trust that Dave and Julie will rear Jacob and Lily and Timothy and Shelley will rear Jack. We support them and help out but we are not responsible for the outcome.
Pastor, if you want to grow your church, resign from running and doing everything.
Karen and I do love our grandchildren but we do not want to rear them. The photo below shows our son Timothy and his wife Shelley giving their two month old son, Jack, medicine. It is wonderful to have grown kids who love, nurture, discipline and care for their own children.
The church is a family of families but far too often the pastor is seen as the one person who is to not only do all the reproducing but then fed, nurture, love, heal and educate all the new babies. Remember: Shepherds do not have sheep; sheep have sheep!
Grandparents do not have grandchildren, our children do.
If you are a pastor or evangelist that thinks you must win, build, nurture, heal, visit and preach, you are confused. You are not God nor are you the parent. We love our grandkids and try to be with them often. However, we are NOT their parents. We trust that Dave and Julie will rear Jacob and Lily and Timothy and Shelley will rear Jack. We support them and help out but we are not responsible for the outcome.
Pastor, if you want to grow your church, resign from running and doing everything.
Church Growth Models
Why do some churches grow large and others stay tiny or small? Because the leaders want it that way. I drive a PT Cruiser. It is a small car with retro styling, hard seats, room for my golf clubs and a short wheel base for parking. It also has a stick shift. It cost only $15,000.00
I could drive a big car with a big engine and soft seats, a long wheel base and fancy interior. At times I want a nice stereo system, automatic shifting, plush seats and a German V8 engine with 300 horses under the hood. But I do not want to spend the $40,000.00 necessary to buy one.
Many people want a small, comfortable family church where everyone is known and the pastor is close to everyone and all the people are comfortable with each other. The routine is fixed and few people join who are different from the core group.
Many of the smaller churches could grow but they prefer to stay small. The may talk about evangelism but the only people who are acceptable are those already like the members and leaders. People may visit for awhile but they leave after failing to fit in.
This might be called a "boutique church". Some small stores stock only hats or special shoes or flowers. They specialize in one thing and are not going to change. They are small and want to stay that way. They will stay at a membership smaller than 100.
Other churches are like a store that and sells various products but will not be a full service center. They are similar to a United Dairy Farmer store and stick with 125 to 150 people in attendance.
Krogers, however, is a traditional grocery that has expanded into a Super Center and sells flowers, has a bank, a deli, bakes bread and serves Starbucks. The super church will have several special programs for children, youth, men, women, choirs, etc and top out at 350 people.
The new approach to retail can be seen in a modified strip mall with large anchor stores, specialty shops, restaurants, big box stores and a variety of services. Churches of 600 plus can fit into this model for they have many services for the varied groups. Not only are youth and children served but charismatics, Hispanics, seniors, rock and roll or unplugged music as well as all kinds of weekly activities. It is a 24 X 7 operation that never sleeps. There are many counseling, healing, 12 step groups and outreach services to the community.
Another option can be compared to a college that includes the retail services but that has a philosophy of equipping people for the wider community and not just its own growth. It has all the services noted above but also sponsors training events for other churches and parachurch groups. It will grow, offers a variety of worship styles and win people to Christ but does not desire to be the biggest church in town, preferring to maintain a mass large enough to provide the people and financial resources necessary to reach the world. In this model the pastoral staff is professorial in orientation not doing direct ministry except to mentor others. (1000 to 2000)
The Mega Mall Model attempts to serve the largest mass of consumers possible. Every conceivable type of store is present and people choose the type of service they prefer. The people prefer anonymity, options, quality music in a concert style. The leaders are extremely focused on their own mall and rarely deviate from the formula they have designed. They hope to serve over 2000 persons at the weekly services but rarely cooperate with other malls or serve others with a different philosophy.
Who do you want to be?
Why do some churches grow large and others stay tiny or small? Because the leaders want it that way. I drive a PT Cruiser. It is a small car with retro styling, hard seats, room for my golf clubs and a short wheel base for parking. It also has a stick shift. It cost only $15,000.00
I could drive a big car with a big engine and soft seats, a long wheel base and fancy interior. At times I want a nice stereo system, automatic shifting, plush seats and a German V8 engine with 300 horses under the hood. But I do not want to spend the $40,000.00 necessary to buy one.
Many people want a small, comfortable family church where everyone is known and the pastor is close to everyone and all the people are comfortable with each other. The routine is fixed and few people join who are different from the core group.
Many of the smaller churches could grow but they prefer to stay small. The may talk about evangelism but the only people who are acceptable are those already like the members and leaders. People may visit for awhile but they leave after failing to fit in.
This might be called a "boutique church". Some small stores stock only hats or special shoes or flowers. They specialize in one thing and are not going to change. They are small and want to stay that way. They will stay at a membership smaller than 100.
Other churches are like a store that and sells various products but will not be a full service center. They are similar to a United Dairy Farmer store and stick with 125 to 150 people in attendance.
Krogers, however, is a traditional grocery that has expanded into a Super Center and sells flowers, has a bank, a deli, bakes bread and serves Starbucks. The super church will have several special programs for children, youth, men, women, choirs, etc and top out at 350 people.
The new approach to retail can be seen in a modified strip mall with large anchor stores, specialty shops, restaurants, big box stores and a variety of services. Churches of 600 plus can fit into this model for they have many services for the varied groups. Not only are youth and children served but charismatics, Hispanics, seniors, rock and roll or unplugged music as well as all kinds of weekly activities. It is a 24 X 7 operation that never sleeps. There are many counseling, healing, 12 step groups and outreach services to the community.
Another option can be compared to a college that includes the retail services but that has a philosophy of equipping people for the wider community and not just its own growth. It has all the services noted above but also sponsors training events for other churches and parachurch groups. It will grow, offers a variety of worship styles and win people to Christ but does not desire to be the biggest church in town, preferring to maintain a mass large enough to provide the people and financial resources necessary to reach the world. In this model the pastoral staff is professorial in orientation not doing direct ministry except to mentor others. (1000 to 2000)
The Mega Mall Model attempts to serve the largest mass of consumers possible. Every conceivable type of store is present and people choose the type of service they prefer. The people prefer anonymity, options, quality music in a concert style. The leaders are extremely focused on their own mall and rarely deviate from the formula they have designed. They hope to serve over 2000 persons at the weekly services but rarely cooperate with other malls or serve others with a different philosophy.
Who do you want to be?
LifeWay Top 10 Issues www.lifeway.com
Top_10_Issues.UM.A.1.422726@unity.lifeway.com
This LifeWay is the publishing and training arm of the Southern Baptist Convention. It is not associated with our ministry. They sent their pastors a survey asking what were the top ten issues facing the church. Below is their response list.
10. AbortionThe church's lack of an effective response to 30+ years of legalized abortion.
9. HomosexualityThe rising social pressure to accept same-sex behavior and relationships.
8. RelevanceThe seeming inability of the church to answer questions one has living in the "real world."
7. MarriageThe negative effects on families that result from divorce, adultery, etc.
6. ApathyThe seeming lack of personal interest, support, and enthusiasm from the pews for the work of the church.
5. Doctrine/WorldviewThe growing pressure to compromise principles to make truths more palatable to an audience. The widening influence of explicitly anti-Christian culture and negative influences on the church.
4. EvangelismThe decline among Christians in personal sharing of the Gospel.
3. LeadershipThe need for clear, biblical vision and direction by church leaders.
2. DiscipleshipThe need for involvement of every believer in being continually transformed into the image of Christ.
1. PrayerThe need for more ongoing, passionate prayer in both personal and church life.
Comments: This list is confusing for it mixes up issues that Christians have nor control or influence over such as homosexuality with issues directly related to church ministry like prayer, evangelism and discipleship.
This confusion is amplified by the fact that issues vary church to church and region to region.
Third, we ought not spend our limited capital of time, energy, money and teaching on things that we cannot influence or called to confront. Some of these seem to be political rather than spiritual and are far too nebulous to influence.
I think we ought never base our ministry on felt needs. Needs always outrun our gifts, our call and our abilities.
We ought to do nothing but what God calls us as people and churches to do. That is why SEEKING PRAYER, listening to God, is our most critical priority.
What do you think?
Top_10_Issues.UM.A.1.422726@unity.lifeway.com
This LifeWay is the publishing and training arm of the Southern Baptist Convention. It is not associated with our ministry. They sent their pastors a survey asking what were the top ten issues facing the church. Below is their response list.
10. AbortionThe church's lack of an effective response to 30+ years of legalized abortion.
9. HomosexualityThe rising social pressure to accept same-sex behavior and relationships.
8. RelevanceThe seeming inability of the church to answer questions one has living in the "real world."
7. MarriageThe negative effects on families that result from divorce, adultery, etc.
6. ApathyThe seeming lack of personal interest, support, and enthusiasm from the pews for the work of the church.
5. Doctrine/WorldviewThe growing pressure to compromise principles to make truths more palatable to an audience. The widening influence of explicitly anti-Christian culture and negative influences on the church.
4. EvangelismThe decline among Christians in personal sharing of the Gospel.
3. LeadershipThe need for clear, biblical vision and direction by church leaders.
2. DiscipleshipThe need for involvement of every believer in being continually transformed into the image of Christ.
1. PrayerThe need for more ongoing, passionate prayer in both personal and church life.
Comments: This list is confusing for it mixes up issues that Christians have nor control or influence over such as homosexuality with issues directly related to church ministry like prayer, evangelism and discipleship.
This confusion is amplified by the fact that issues vary church to church and region to region.
Third, we ought not spend our limited capital of time, energy, money and teaching on things that we cannot influence or called to confront. Some of these seem to be political rather than spiritual and are far too nebulous to influence.
I think we ought never base our ministry on felt needs. Needs always outrun our gifts, our call and our abilities.
We ought to do nothing but what God calls us as people and churches to do. That is why SEEKING PRAYER, listening to God, is our most critical priority.
What do you think?
Friday, April 15, 2005
Church Growth
I am a reader. My therapist accused me of being an information addict. I confess. I am. Readers know that there are many books and articles that are shallow or even harmful for they offer good advice that is anti growth.
When I say growth, I mean several things.
1. Numerical growth by evangelism. Unbelievers actually becoming believers that expands the total members of committed Christians in one congregation.
2. Personal spiritual growth into maturity. The term is Teleios and can be translated, perfect but means mature, whole and complete not without sin or error.
3. Organizational growth. When a group expands numerically it must expand organically as well. New wineskins must replace the old.
4. Impact outside the congregation. Lives, groups, political systems, etc need the wisdom, influence and assistance of the church.
5. Growth in healthy persons. Jesus came to heal and so the church must also be a place of healing.
6. Add other categories.
Anyone interested in church growth needs to read, reflect upon and reread several books.
1. Natural Church Growth, by Christian Schwartz.
2. The Churching of America, by Rodney Starke
3. The Very Large Church, by Lyle Schaller
Cincinnati needs many more new church plants and many new very large churches if our culture and region is to be touched by the Spirit of God. Read, reflect and go for it.
I am a reader. My therapist accused me of being an information addict. I confess. I am. Readers know that there are many books and articles that are shallow or even harmful for they offer good advice that is anti growth.
When I say growth, I mean several things.
1. Numerical growth by evangelism. Unbelievers actually becoming believers that expands the total members of committed Christians in one congregation.
2. Personal spiritual growth into maturity. The term is Teleios and can be translated, perfect but means mature, whole and complete not without sin or error.
3. Organizational growth. When a group expands numerically it must expand organically as well. New wineskins must replace the old.
4. Impact outside the congregation. Lives, groups, political systems, etc need the wisdom, influence and assistance of the church.
5. Growth in healthy persons. Jesus came to heal and so the church must also be a place of healing.
6. Add other categories.
Anyone interested in church growth needs to read, reflect upon and reread several books.
1. Natural Church Growth, by Christian Schwartz.
2. The Churching of America, by Rodney Starke
3. The Very Large Church, by Lyle Schaller
Cincinnati needs many more new church plants and many new very large churches if our culture and region is to be touched by the Spirit of God. Read, reflect and go for it.
Life in Orlando
I spent a few days in Orlando with a couple of old friends from many years ago and made some new friends at Pine Castle Methodist Church. Terry and Pam Fisher met and married while on the staff at College Hill Presbyterian Church in Cincinnati. They have traveled widely to minister in several congregations from coast to coast and now live and minister in Orlando with Blake Lorenz and his team of merry believers in a very Spirit filled church.
Terry had been a cutting edge musician and street minister who was called into the Jesus House Ministry in the beginning of the Jesus Movement in the late Sixties. This was the beginning of what some call the Fourth Great Awakening. Randy Matthews invited Terry to minister at the Jesus House. Randy was the very first person to record a rock and roll style Christian song of that era. He was also a student at the local Christian Bible College, a school that came from the Restoration Movement, a part of the Second Great Awakening of the early 1800's.
I had a great time of ministry with the men at a retreat where we discussed many issues of inner healing, knowing Christ as both Savior and Healer as well as claiming our new identity in Christ as adopted Eldest Sons. That group really knows how to worship and pray.
The need for emotional healing is great but there are few places it is being carried out. Some twenty years ago many churches and healing centers promoted inner healing in addition to physical healing. But many pastors are evidently scared of drawing too many distressed people if they provide prayer and counseling.
At Pine Castle I experienced a confluence of the past and the present need. It was in the Jesus Movement that I first heard about inner healing and began to study how prayer fit into counseling. Here I was some 30 years later teaching men how to do what I learned back then. The Bible never goes out of style.
I spent a few days in Orlando with a couple of old friends from many years ago and made some new friends at Pine Castle Methodist Church. Terry and Pam Fisher met and married while on the staff at College Hill Presbyterian Church in Cincinnati. They have traveled widely to minister in several congregations from coast to coast and now live and minister in Orlando with Blake Lorenz and his team of merry believers in a very Spirit filled church.
Terry had been a cutting edge musician and street minister who was called into the Jesus House Ministry in the beginning of the Jesus Movement in the late Sixties. This was the beginning of what some call the Fourth Great Awakening. Randy Matthews invited Terry to minister at the Jesus House. Randy was the very first person to record a rock and roll style Christian song of that era. He was also a student at the local Christian Bible College, a school that came from the Restoration Movement, a part of the Second Great Awakening of the early 1800's.
I had a great time of ministry with the men at a retreat where we discussed many issues of inner healing, knowing Christ as both Savior and Healer as well as claiming our new identity in Christ as adopted Eldest Sons. That group really knows how to worship and pray.
The need for emotional healing is great but there are few places it is being carried out. Some twenty years ago many churches and healing centers promoted inner healing in addition to physical healing. But many pastors are evidently scared of drawing too many distressed people if they provide prayer and counseling.
At Pine Castle I experienced a confluence of the past and the present need. It was in the Jesus Movement that I first heard about inner healing and began to study how prayer fit into counseling. Here I was some 30 years later teaching men how to do what I learned back then. The Bible never goes out of style.
Wednesday, April 06, 2005
This is the Third Segment on Prayers
Finally, it makes no difference in pastoral ministry what we believe or what we say if it is not in accord with the Spirit's leading for that specific time and that place and that person. As a former basketball coach I learned that the best practices prepared my team for the unpredictable events that occur on the floor. And they always did occur. I taught the basics of passing, defense, shooting and endurance because that is what the players need to do to win.
Personal ministry is like war or sports. The actual battles have structure and follow principles but no predictability. I hate to hear Monday morning quarterbacks say what a coach should have done when most of them have never, ever played sports. Intuitively doing what is best in a game requires many hours of practice in cold, lonely gyms.
For the past 30 years I have taught the basic principles of listening, thinking, prayer and healthy relationships to leaders around the world. Many well known seminar leaders teach specific techniques of ministry but I prefer principles and processes so the people will learn how to hear God and follow His lead.
Follow good principles of deep heart listening.
Tune in to the Spirit and to the Seeker.
Be slow to speak and quick to listen.
Do not sing happy songs to a heavy heart
Do not offer pearls of wisdom to people in pain.
Ask the Seeker what has been most helpful to her.
Ask her when God was present.
Ask her what happened.
Ask her what God said to her.
Ask if her question has already been answered. In most cases God has already spoken and told her the answers to her questions and she wants to tell you what He said. (I have a chapter on this in Humpty Dumpty)
Our faith is worthless if we fail to conform to God's directives. God called me to be a warrior to cast down strongholds in His Name. His Kingdom is evident whenever we defeat sin, Satan and psychopathology.
This is not a mechanical or automatically thing that happens as a result of my superior knowledge. It is rather a result of knowing Him experientially in the midst of ministry.
(I do NOT know how to pray as I ought!)
Do not rejoice that the spirits are subject to you but that you name is written in the book of life. (Luke 10:26) Know WHO you are and solid ministry will surely follow. Do not be concerned about WHAT to do or say. It is God who leads the way.
gsweeten@lifewaycenters.com
Finally, it makes no difference in pastoral ministry what we believe or what we say if it is not in accord with the Spirit's leading for that specific time and that place and that person. As a former basketball coach I learned that the best practices prepared my team for the unpredictable events that occur on the floor. And they always did occur. I taught the basics of passing, defense, shooting and endurance because that is what the players need to do to win.
Personal ministry is like war or sports. The actual battles have structure and follow principles but no predictability. I hate to hear Monday morning quarterbacks say what a coach should have done when most of them have never, ever played sports. Intuitively doing what is best in a game requires many hours of practice in cold, lonely gyms.
For the past 30 years I have taught the basic principles of listening, thinking, prayer and healthy relationships to leaders around the world. Many well known seminar leaders teach specific techniques of ministry but I prefer principles and processes so the people will learn how to hear God and follow His lead.
Follow good principles of deep heart listening.
Tune in to the Spirit and to the Seeker.
Be slow to speak and quick to listen.
Do not sing happy songs to a heavy heart
Do not offer pearls of wisdom to people in pain.
Ask the Seeker what has been most helpful to her.
Ask her when God was present.
Ask her what happened.
Ask her what God said to her.
Ask if her question has already been answered. In most cases God has already spoken and told her the answers to her questions and she wants to tell you what He said. (I have a chapter on this in Humpty Dumpty)
Our faith is worthless if we fail to conform to God's directives. God called me to be a warrior to cast down strongholds in His Name. His Kingdom is evident whenever we defeat sin, Satan and psychopathology.
This is not a mechanical or automatically thing that happens as a result of my superior knowledge. It is rather a result of knowing Him experientially in the midst of ministry.
(I do NOT know how to pray as I ought!)
Do not rejoice that the spirits are subject to you but that you name is written in the book of life. (Luke 10:26) Know WHO you are and solid ministry will surely follow. Do not be concerned about WHAT to do or say. It is God who leads the way.
gsweeten@lifewaycenters.com
Three Ways to Pray
There are three kinds of prayers and personal ministry for hurting persons.
1. Seeking Prayers that admit our lack of understanding and our need for God's direction even how and what to pray.
It also means that we are co-workers with the Spirit. We are not in charge of the ministry process. We collaborate with the Holy Spirit.
Usually a question does not demand a direct answer. In this case I wonder if the woman is asking something deeper. It may seem as though she wonders, "Where was God?", but maybe she is pondering something far more important. Perhaps she is asking, "Can I trust God now?" and "Can I trust you guys who claim to speak for God?"
So, at this point I would be hesitant to offer any definitive theological answer. First of all, we do not know the answer. Second, she will not accept it. Third, she will probably interrupt and say, "Yes, but..."
Many times a question requires us to admit we do not know what to say but we will pray for wisdom and asked her to explain what she is concerned about. Listen, listen, listen for out of the overflow of the mouth the heart speaks. (Luke 6:36 ff)
My books Listening for Heaven's Sake and Hope and Change for Humpty Dumpty teach this in some detail.
2. Speaking Prayers focus on what we say to God. After getting direction we can speak about what He said but it is not wise to say more than that. Many times people ask me to pray for things that I will not agree to say. Will you pray for my cancer? I answer, "I will seek God's direction and then speak to Him about what I heard."
May years ago a women asked for prayer for her colon cancer. My partner, Marie Martin, prayed a Seeking Prayer discernment that there was conflict with her husband. After three denials and times of probing the lady admitted her rage, cursed him and told of her severe unforgiveness, bitterness and hatred. Then we knew how to pray for her and could Speak to God with intelligence.
3. Soaking Prayers are required for chronic or very difficult situations. They include both Seeking and Speaking in an ongoing dialogue with God. The abused lady in question seems to need this kind of ministry. It may take teams many hours for many weeks to find release for this situation. In addition, abuse may be generational and include the entire family system so Soaking will be essential in breaking the cycle of these types of problems.
Take your time. The problems did not appear overnight and they will not likely evaporate in one prayer session. Relax and enjoy the process. God loves it when we enter into His presence.
There are three kinds of prayers and personal ministry for hurting persons.
1. Seeking Prayers that admit our lack of understanding and our need for God's direction even how and what to pray.
It also means that we are co-workers with the Spirit. We are not in charge of the ministry process. We collaborate with the Holy Spirit.
Usually a question does not demand a direct answer. In this case I wonder if the woman is asking something deeper. It may seem as though she wonders, "Where was God?", but maybe she is pondering something far more important. Perhaps she is asking, "Can I trust God now?" and "Can I trust you guys who claim to speak for God?"
So, at this point I would be hesitant to offer any definitive theological answer. First of all, we do not know the answer. Second, she will not accept it. Third, she will probably interrupt and say, "Yes, but..."
Many times a question requires us to admit we do not know what to say but we will pray for wisdom and asked her to explain what she is concerned about. Listen, listen, listen for out of the overflow of the mouth the heart speaks. (Luke 6:36 ff)
My books Listening for Heaven's Sake and Hope and Change for Humpty Dumpty teach this in some detail.
2. Speaking Prayers focus on what we say to God. After getting direction we can speak about what He said but it is not wise to say more than that. Many times people ask me to pray for things that I will not agree to say. Will you pray for my cancer? I answer, "I will seek God's direction and then speak to Him about what I heard."
May years ago a women asked for prayer for her colon cancer. My partner, Marie Martin, prayed a Seeking Prayer discernment that there was conflict with her husband. After three denials and times of probing the lady admitted her rage, cursed him and told of her severe unforgiveness, bitterness and hatred. Then we knew how to pray for her and could Speak to God with intelligence.
3. Soaking Prayers are required for chronic or very difficult situations. They include both Seeking and Speaking in an ongoing dialogue with God. The abused lady in question seems to need this kind of ministry. It may take teams many hours for many weeks to find release for this situation. In addition, abuse may be generational and include the entire family system so Soaking will be essential in breaking the cycle of these types of problems.
Take your time. The problems did not appear overnight and they will not likely evaporate in one prayer session. Relax and enjoy the process. God loves it when we enter into His presence.
A Big Question
I recently was asked to respond to this letter from a pastor.
Dear Dr. Gary,
I have a tough question. What do I tell woman who was severely abused as a child when she asks where God was when she was being hurt?I want to tell her that in the same way God was with Christ he was with her. However, it may be cold comfort to her to hear such theology.
Sincerely,
A Puzzled Pastor
I agree. Good answers are too often "cold comfort".
Dealing with ongoing abuse is very challenging. There are many instances when a Seeker's question does not require an answer. The theological "answer" to a question about such horrible abuse would require a volume of theological discussions by many wise and biblically literate folk then there would be disagreements, when an abuse victim asks me where God was she doesn't want, need or require deep theology but deep listening.
Why do we often refrain from offering answers to hurting people? It is simple. We do not know how to pray as we ought. Thankfully, the Holy Spirit intercedes for us with groans too deep for human understanding. (RO 8:26)
Are You not amazed that St Paul admitted he did not know how to pray? If he was confused and had to depend on the guidance of the Holy Spirit just imagine how confused we non-saints are. Confronting the evil of abuse may leave us silent and unable to utter anything except a cry of pain and the release of tears for "We weep with those who weep".
Praise God for He knows exactly what to do and say.
I recently was asked to respond to this letter from a pastor.
Dear Dr. Gary,
I have a tough question. What do I tell woman who was severely abused as a child when she asks where God was when she was being hurt?I want to tell her that in the same way God was with Christ he was with her. However, it may be cold comfort to her to hear such theology.
Sincerely,
A Puzzled Pastor
I agree. Good answers are too often "cold comfort".
Dealing with ongoing abuse is very challenging. There are many instances when a Seeker's question does not require an answer. The theological "answer" to a question about such horrible abuse would require a volume of theological discussions by many wise and biblically literate folk then there would be disagreements, when an abuse victim asks me where God was she doesn't want, need or require deep theology but deep listening.
Why do we often refrain from offering answers to hurting people? It is simple. We do not know how to pray as we ought. Thankfully, the Holy Spirit intercedes for us with groans too deep for human understanding. (RO 8:26)
Are You not amazed that St Paul admitted he did not know how to pray? If he was confused and had to depend on the guidance of the Holy Spirit just imagine how confused we non-saints are. Confronting the evil of abuse may leave us silent and unable to utter anything except a cry of pain and the release of tears for "We weep with those who weep".
Praise God for He knows exactly what to do and say.
Saturday, April 02, 2005
Leave Mother and Father
The Terri Schiavo situation has many twists and turns for considering how
we are connected to each other and to God. As I watch TV and read about how
this entire episode has been handled I wonder how I, as a pastor and family
therapist, would counsel any family in a similar situation. (We faced it at College Hill Presbyterian. The pressure was awful.)
First, we need to think about how enmeshed her family of origin was to her and
she was to them. Eating disorders often imply a person who is trying to "leave
mother and father" but does not know how. To be differentiated is a basic part
of God's plan. Emotional enmeshment makes good decisions almost impossible.
Second, the conflict between Michael Schiavo and his in-laws makes resolution
very tough. Their traingled conflict pulls us into our own unresolved conflict.
Perhaps a private counseling session could help. However, since there is so
much unresolved emotion counseling would be tough.
Third, there are several vicious triangles involving Terri, her illness, Michael,
the Shindlers, the medical establishment, religious leaders, the media, etc.
Wow! It is so difficult to think about this without encountering rabid
emotional reactions on every side. Interlocking triangles make peaceful
discussions very difficult. Trying to resolve such issues in the public eye
with lawyersmakes it even more daunting. They are pulled in and so are
we so our unresolved issues get projected onto Terri. Michael, the parents,
etc.
Fourth, what is the nature of a person who cannot speak or respond? The
article below is an interesting meditation on the nature of humans. He
illuminate what I try to say about the Hebrew-Christian way of thinking.
We are connected somehow to God and others. This is why it is best to
think systemically about illness, prayer and other ways to bring health.
Fifth, we who minister have opportunities to bring peace and resolution to
families in crisis if we can stay peaceful and focused. This means that privacy
is essential. Themedia always raises anxiety levels and people do stupid things
when they are anxious. Thankfully, the risenMessiah always says, "Peace" to
those who are anxious.
Shalom,
Gary Sweeten
Wall Street Journal
http://www.opinionjournal.com/taste/?id=110006500
April 1, 2005
HOUSES OF WORSHIP
The Soul of a ControversyAfter Terri Schiavo's death, questions remain.BY DAVID B. HARTFriday, April 1, 2005 12:01 a.m.
Terri Schiavo has now died, but of course the controversy surrounding her last days will persist indefinitely. Most of the issues raised as she was dying were legal and moral; but at the margins of the storm, questions of a more "metaphysical" nature were occasionally raised in public. For instance, I heard three people on the radio last week speculating on the whereabouts of her "soul."
One opined that where consciousness has sunk below a certain minimally responsive level, the soul has already departed the body; the other two thought that the soul remains, but as a dormant prisoner of the ruined flesh, awaiting release. Their arguments, being intuitive, were of little interest. What caught my attention was the unreflective dualism to which all three clearly subscribed: The soul, they assumed, is a kind of magical essence haunting the body, a ghost in a machine.
This is in fact a peculiarly modern view of the matter, not much older than the 17th-century philosophy of Descartes. While it is now the model to which most of us habitually revert when talking about the soul-- whether we believe in such things or not--it has scant basis in either Christian or Jewish tradition.
The "living soul" of Scripture is the whole corporeal and spiritual totality of a person whom the breath of God has wakened to life. Thomas Aquinas, interpreting centuries of Christian and pagan metaphysics, defined the immortal soul as the "form of the body," the vital power animating, pervading, shaping an individual from the moment of conception, drawing all the energies of life into a unity.
This is not to deny that, for Christian tradition, the soul transcends and survives the earthly life of the body. It is only to say that the soul, rather than being a kind of "guest" within the self, is instead the underlying mystery of a life in its fullness. In it the multiplicity of experience is knit into a single continuous and developing identity. It encompasses all the dimensions of human existence: animal functions and abstract intellect, sensation and reason, emotion and reflection, flesh and spirit, natural aptitude and supernatural longing. As such, it grants us an openness to the world of which no other creature is capable, allowing us to take in reality through feeling and thought, recognition and surprise, will and desire, memory and anticipation, imagination and curiosity, delight and sorrow, invention and art.
The fourth-century theologian Gregory of Nyssa calls the soul a "living mirror" in which all things shine, so immense in its capacity that it can, when turned toward the light of God, grow eternally in an ever greater embrace of divine beauty. For the seventh-century theologian Maximus the Confessor, the human soul is the "boundary" between material and spiritual reality--heaven and earth--and so constitutes a microcosm that joins together, in itself, all the spheres of being.
I doubt even the dogmatic materialists among us are wholly insensible to the miraculous oddity that in the midst of organic nature there exists a creature so exorbitantly in excess of what material causality could possibly adumbrate, a living mirror where all splendors gather, an animal who is also a creative and interpretive being with a longing for eternity. Whether one is willing to speak of a "rational soul" or not, there is obviously an irreducible mystery here, one that commands our reverence.
Granted, it is easiest to sense this mystery when gazing at the Sistine Chapel's ceiling or listening to Bach. But it should be evident--for Christians at least--even when everything glorious and prodigious in our nature has been stripped away and all that remains is frailty, brokenness and dependency, or when a person we love has been largely lost to us in the labyrinth of a damaged brain. Even among such ravages--for those with the eyes to see it--a terrible dignity still shines out. I do not understand exactly why those who wanted Terri Schiavo to die had become so resolute in their purposes by the end. If she was as "vegetative" as they believed, what harm would it have done, I wonder, to surrender her to the charity (however fruitless) of her parents?
Of this I am certain, though: Christians who understand their faith are obliged to believe that she was, to the last, a living soul. It is true that, in some real sense, it was her soul that those who loved her could no longer reach, but it was also her soul that they touched with their hands and spoke to and grieved over and adored. And this also means that it was a living soul that we as a society chose to abandon to starvation and thirst--which should, at the very least, give us cause to consider what else we may have abandoned along the way.
Mr. Hart, an Eastern Orthodox theologian, is the author of "The Beauty of the Infinite" (Eerdmans). Copyright © 2005 Dow Jones & Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
The Terri Schiavo situation has many twists and turns for considering how
we are connected to each other and to God. As I watch TV and read about how
this entire episode has been handled I wonder how I, as a pastor and family
therapist, would counsel any family in a similar situation. (We faced it at College Hill Presbyterian. The pressure was awful.)
First, we need to think about how enmeshed her family of origin was to her and
she was to them. Eating disorders often imply a person who is trying to "leave
mother and father" but does not know how. To be differentiated is a basic part
of God's plan. Emotional enmeshment makes good decisions almost impossible.
Second, the conflict between Michael Schiavo and his in-laws makes resolution
very tough. Their traingled conflict pulls us into our own unresolved conflict.
Perhaps a private counseling session could help. However, since there is so
much unresolved emotion counseling would be tough.
Third, there are several vicious triangles involving Terri, her illness, Michael,
the Shindlers, the medical establishment, religious leaders, the media, etc.
Wow! It is so difficult to think about this without encountering rabid
emotional reactions on every side. Interlocking triangles make peaceful
discussions very difficult. Trying to resolve such issues in the public eye
with lawyersmakes it even more daunting. They are pulled in and so are
we so our unresolved issues get projected onto Terri. Michael, the parents,
etc.
Fourth, what is the nature of a person who cannot speak or respond? The
article below is an interesting meditation on the nature of humans. He
illuminate what I try to say about the Hebrew-Christian way of thinking.
We are connected somehow to God and others. This is why it is best to
think systemically about illness, prayer and other ways to bring health.
Fifth, we who minister have opportunities to bring peace and resolution to
families in crisis if we can stay peaceful and focused. This means that privacy
is essential. Themedia always raises anxiety levels and people do stupid things
when they are anxious. Thankfully, the risenMessiah always says, "Peace" to
those who are anxious.
Shalom,
Gary Sweeten
Wall Street Journal
http://www.opinionjournal.com/taste/?id=110006500
April 1, 2005
HOUSES OF WORSHIP
The Soul of a ControversyAfter Terri Schiavo's death, questions remain.BY DAVID B. HARTFriday, April 1, 2005 12:01 a.m.
Terri Schiavo has now died, but of course the controversy surrounding her last days will persist indefinitely. Most of the issues raised as she was dying were legal and moral; but at the margins of the storm, questions of a more "metaphysical" nature were occasionally raised in public. For instance, I heard three people on the radio last week speculating on the whereabouts of her "soul."
One opined that where consciousness has sunk below a certain minimally responsive level, the soul has already departed the body; the other two thought that the soul remains, but as a dormant prisoner of the ruined flesh, awaiting release. Their arguments, being intuitive, were of little interest. What caught my attention was the unreflective dualism to which all three clearly subscribed: The soul, they assumed, is a kind of magical essence haunting the body, a ghost in a machine.
This is in fact a peculiarly modern view of the matter, not much older than the 17th-century philosophy of Descartes. While it is now the model to which most of us habitually revert when talking about the soul-- whether we believe in such things or not--it has scant basis in either Christian or Jewish tradition.
The "living soul" of Scripture is the whole corporeal and spiritual totality of a person whom the breath of God has wakened to life. Thomas Aquinas, interpreting centuries of Christian and pagan metaphysics, defined the immortal soul as the "form of the body," the vital power animating, pervading, shaping an individual from the moment of conception, drawing all the energies of life into a unity.
This is not to deny that, for Christian tradition, the soul transcends and survives the earthly life of the body. It is only to say that the soul, rather than being a kind of "guest" within the self, is instead the underlying mystery of a life in its fullness. In it the multiplicity of experience is knit into a single continuous and developing identity. It encompasses all the dimensions of human existence: animal functions and abstract intellect, sensation and reason, emotion and reflection, flesh and spirit, natural aptitude and supernatural longing. As such, it grants us an openness to the world of which no other creature is capable, allowing us to take in reality through feeling and thought, recognition and surprise, will and desire, memory and anticipation, imagination and curiosity, delight and sorrow, invention and art.
The fourth-century theologian Gregory of Nyssa calls the soul a "living mirror" in which all things shine, so immense in its capacity that it can, when turned toward the light of God, grow eternally in an ever greater embrace of divine beauty. For the seventh-century theologian Maximus the Confessor, the human soul is the "boundary" between material and spiritual reality--heaven and earth--and so constitutes a microcosm that joins together, in itself, all the spheres of being.
I doubt even the dogmatic materialists among us are wholly insensible to the miraculous oddity that in the midst of organic nature there exists a creature so exorbitantly in excess of what material causality could possibly adumbrate, a living mirror where all splendors gather, an animal who is also a creative and interpretive being with a longing for eternity. Whether one is willing to speak of a "rational soul" or not, there is obviously an irreducible mystery here, one that commands our reverence.
Granted, it is easiest to sense this mystery when gazing at the Sistine Chapel's ceiling or listening to Bach. But it should be evident--for Christians at least--even when everything glorious and prodigious in our nature has been stripped away and all that remains is frailty, brokenness and dependency, or when a person we love has been largely lost to us in the labyrinth of a damaged brain. Even among such ravages--for those with the eyes to see it--a terrible dignity still shines out. I do not understand exactly why those who wanted Terri Schiavo to die had become so resolute in their purposes by the end. If she was as "vegetative" as they believed, what harm would it have done, I wonder, to surrender her to the charity (however fruitless) of her parents?
Of this I am certain, though: Christians who understand their faith are obliged to believe that she was, to the last, a living soul. It is true that, in some real sense, it was her soul that those who loved her could no longer reach, but it was also her soul that they touched with their hands and spoke to and grieved over and adored. And this also means that it was a living soul that we as a society chose to abandon to starvation and thirst--which should, at the very least, give us cause to consider what else we may have abandoned along the way.
Mr. Hart, an Eastern Orthodox theologian, is the author of "The Beauty of the Infinite" (Eerdmans). Copyright © 2005 Dow Jones & Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Friday, April 01, 2005
Fruitfulness
One of the great things about getting old in ministry is the fact that the seeds we sowed many years ago has time to grow, blossom and develop its own fruit. Within the past few months two persons to whom we ministered intensely at the Teleios Center for Lay Ministry at College Hill Presbyterian Church have appeared in the news.
Joan Murren-Murrel came to CHPC almost thirty years ago after her pastor attended one of our LIFE Seminar. Here he learned about the ways we tried to help distressed believers. After a rather tumulterous and stormy time Joan found herself pregnant with no ability to care for the child. She made a very courageous decision and we found a family that wanted a child.
You can read the rest of Joan's exciting story at:
http://www.chpc.org/hotpress/hotpress040305.html
Our efforts DO matter even if it takes 30 years to see the fruit.
One of the great things about getting old in ministry is the fact that the seeds we sowed many years ago has time to grow, blossom and develop its own fruit. Within the past few months two persons to whom we ministered intensely at the Teleios Center for Lay Ministry at College Hill Presbyterian Church have appeared in the news.
Joan Murren-Murrel came to CHPC almost thirty years ago after her pastor attended one of our LIFE Seminar. Here he learned about the ways we tried to help distressed believers. After a rather tumulterous and stormy time Joan found herself pregnant with no ability to care for the child. She made a very courageous decision and we found a family that wanted a child.
You can read the rest of Joan's exciting story at:
http://www.chpc.org/hotpress/hotpress040305.html
Our efforts DO matter even if it takes 30 years to see the fruit.
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